Link: I sort of sounded like a snit to you also and I apologize. My zeal for truth sometimes gets in the way of the compassion I have for people. It’s there even when it doesn’t show .

To answer your question about believers from false religions, yes, I know many people from false religious backgrounds who God sovereignly saved and they came out of those false religions to join God’s church. I do not know of any true believers according to Biblical description who stay in false religions indefinitely, however. Why would they? I do not believe the roman catholic religion is true. Look at what they believe and compare it to the Bible. Not the same… not even close.

Truthy

Peace.
T.

I’m not sure how many Calvinists you know but you do not know me. I am Christian first and I trust the Bible. Calvin merely summed up things as he saw them and did a pretty good job. Election or predsetination is of God. If someone is in the RC and God calls them, they will come out and be saved. It is not a fact of man’s ‘decision’. God is indeed sovereign. The Bible shows us this. Read it from Genesis to Maps…

Peace (predetermined),
T.

Maam, I must admit that the teaching on salvation of the RC are false. However I must also say the 5pt crowd is false as well. I mean think about it…..why are the calvinists so upset with you in the RC??? Really God must not love you….you must not be part of “the elect” WORLD. Your in the RC and going to hell because GOD has SOVEREIGNLY DETERMINED that you will.
In all seriousness, trust in Christ and His work alone……..and leave all the teachings of men whether they are popes or Luther/Calvin.

Nice try. You can sing that old “I’m a Christian but I don’t support what the Bible teaches about truth” all that you want. Some may not see through it. If accuracy and truth are not important (my summation of what you have said thus far), why even have a Bible? The “I’m not one to decide; it’s above my paygrade” is a tired old liberal argument. The Bible tells us plainly who is and is not a true believer. Those who hear and follow Christ, suffer persecution, and contend for the faith are likely on the narrow path to eternal life (not because of their actions but their actions reveal salvation) and those who just bob along through life living a contented and uncontested life may be on the broad road…

Remember, Genesis to Maps…and pray for God to open your eyes. Peace out.
T.

Examine the RC belief statements. You will find they are a nonChristian cult. Now, just because there are Baptists and Lutherans who disagree about immersion or dancing (the Baptists are correct ), this is not the same type of disagreement as the one between Bible-believing protestants and the RC cult.

Then there are the word of faith, new mystics, emerging church, prosperity and other heretics who call themselves Christian. There may be some immature Christians who have not yet been led out of these false cults by God. They will be led out at some point however.

Let me go out on a limb here. I would bet that you (link between) do not spend a great deal of time in your Bible? Toss the message, NLT, and other paraphrases and get a real Bible. Read it from Genesis to Maps and you will find out where the 5pt Calvinists are coming from.

Thanks for your interest and please continue to dialog here. Joel posts some great articles.
T.

I don’t think any true believer is going to intentionally, knowingly follow false doctrine or stay within the realm of any false religion. They may be immature in their knowledge, however.

Having said that, Scripture is clear that God calls mankind to salvation from all nations, all religions, and all walks of life, etc.

“And this is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.” – John 17:3

You are correct in saying there are heresies and unbiblical teachings within protestantism. I think you err however, in thinking they are not being addressed from within.

For the record, it’s not just ’5 pt. calvinists’ who reject the roman catholic doctrine of justification, it’s all true Christians. Again, although there may be Christians within the RC organization, it would be erroneous to include the RC organization itself as Christian. It is not. It is actually the world’s largest cult. Those truly in Christ who are now within the RC organization, as well as any other false religion are being called, by the written Word of God, to leave it.

Thanks again for your comments. – Joel

I understand I’m arguing an unwinable battle here with 5 point Calvinists, just wanted to point out for other eyes that may come across this discussion that not all Christians agree on this point, and that we can disagree respectfully (and amicably – thank you for the response, Joel).

There may be some catholics who are Christians. However, I do not see how they could continue to call themselves catholic since the catholic church is built upon false beliefs (pope is God on earth, Mary is divine, pergatory, works-based salvation…).

I agree that action must be taken against bad political and social policy. However, Christians must take action as a force by itself. We have no spiritual fellowship with unbelievers…

http://www.truthinator.wordpress.com

As for the Manhattan Declaration, all lines have been crossed, hands are joined for yet another ecumenical effort. Doing good works jointly is fine, but asking unbelievers to uphold and be fully committed to “the rights of conscience” and “religious freedom” along with other biblical morality is an impossibility while yet being enemies of Christ. It can be feigned, it may be a good fleshly show of ecumenicism, but of what eternal value is it, if those unbelievers who participate end up in Hell?

The last thing I desire is to ‘keep Jesus and His message from being heard”. By all means, His message of repentance and faith should be trumpeted.

I urge you, brother, please reconsider how you speak of those you consider to be ‘outside’ your acceptable version of faith. It keeps Jesus and his message from being truly heard by so many who are hurt by the kinds of things you say.